Hawkwind - Corporate Monsters?!

[Anonymous]

After having read something about this on the StG site ....

http://www.sharingthegroove.org/

. . . . I delved into the official site, and read ....

"IMPORTANT REMINDER: For a wide range of reasons, Hawkwind have to ask their fans to cease from recording and trading Hawkwind concerts."

Damn! What's goin' on? Is it a plot? Honestly; this is what I installed a BitTorrent client for!

More importantly, what happens if you don't comply?

NO WAY do I want Dave Brock attacking me with his walking-stick just because I like to download live stuff for free.

Would that happen?

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"My dog may be stupid, but he can hold his own in a fight with a badger".

[KenBoorman]

Apart from being illegal, trading in bootlegged live concert recordings could seriously hamper the band's ability to sign with a major recording company. Why would any company who might be considering signing them do so if they know/suspect there is a thriving underground bootleg swapping operation going on? The band have just asked their fans (who perhaps owe something to the core members for all the years of entertainment provided) to stop publicly trading bootlegs - that's all.

Ken

[Anonymous]

So that's a "yes", then. Thought so!

[Bill]

Well, we could ask the Grateful Dead and Phish for starters. And the taping and trading part isn't necessarily illegal. Certainly the sale would be.

Having said that, if the band says stop, for whatever reason, then I think we have to respect that. We don't have to like it, but I think we do have to honor it.

[zakt]

Ask yourself which is more immoral: shoplifting from a hypermarket or from a cornerstore?

Hawkwind can't afford to lose sales!

[KenBoorman]

Great analogy Zakt - I like that - and agree with you wholeheartedly.

Ken

[Anonymous]

What a bunch of spineless, pro-corporate buffoons! And, probably, hypocrites as well. I mean, does anyone *really* believe that these people don't possess at least *one* bootleg, or somesuch ???!!!

From my download log, start of 2nd quarter (April 1st)
Programs Used : BitTornado, Direct Connect Plus Plus, eMule -

Hawkwind - An Alien Heat (studio outtakes)
Venue : Dave's recording studio.
Date : 1980s
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Hawkwind - Hawkestra - 3xCD's
Brixton Academy
21st Oct 2000
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Hawkwind - Kinetic Playground, Birmingham
6 December 1971
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HAWKWIND - Rock City
Newton Records WAHCD 613 Apr 1994
16-11-1993
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Hawkwind - London Hammersmith Odeon
22nd April 1988
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Hawkwind - Gruga Halle, Essen
8 September 1972
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Hawkwind - Exeter
25 October 2003
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Hawkwind - Birmingham Powerhouse
4th December 1988
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Hawkwind - Rock City, Nottingham
Nov 7 2001
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Hawkwind - Roadmenders, Northampton
Dec 10 2002
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Hawkwind - Paradiso, Amsterdam
March 11, 1977
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Hawkwind - Opera House, Newcastle
14th November 2001
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Hawkwind - Ford Auditorium, Detroit, Michigan
28th November 1973
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All fair to excellent quality.

Read 'em and weep, you goons!

[KenBoorman]

Why would I be weeping? I'm quite happy to have all the legit albums issued plus the authorised videos and DVD's. I don't really need more than 5 versions of the same song played in different venues :)

Ken

[zakt]

Buffoons? Whoo! Yeah, and hypocrites too, in small measure no doubt. As one who's doubtless a big Hawkwind fan, though, don't you think that the dwindling size of their audience indicates a reduction in their income, and therefore you might be more gainfully employed buying their legit product? Your attitude towards Dave's perfectly reasonable request indicates you don't have much respect for the band, so why bother listening? :P

[Corum]

Didnt realise there was so much out there. I would be perfectly happy to play my originals but they are buried in storage half a planet away. The only Hawkwind I can listen to is the two dozen songs I downloaded on KAzaa. I feel I have paid my dues, at least 20 albums and I think the best track I have ever heard by them was my Kazaa Assault and Battery (live) download! I think it was Brixton Hawkestra, but not sure. Would probably buy the CD if I knew for sure it was brill. MP3s arent particularly good sound quality anyway, even after going to several Motorhead concerts I can still tell the difference. Look at them as a loss leader teaser, if it is worth buying and I actually can buy it, I will buy it.

[zakt]

Which is different from some twat recording a gig and selling it for their onw benefit without royalties to DB & co.

[Anonymous]

I don't really need more than 5 versions of the same song played in different venues :)Ken

Hmmm. One moment, and the downloading of live concerts and/or studio outtakes is responsible for not only old Dave losing his reason for living, but also for the fall of Western civilization as we know it; the next, it's just a load of unnecessary, samey old tosh that no-one needs to listen to.

Which is it to be?

Myself, I buy the legitimate stuff - AND download live recordings.

But then, so does everyone. It's just that some don't admit it. Or if they don't, they feel 'left out', and wish they did. Heh!

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"Ensure a good night's sleep by knocking back a large bottle of vodka before going to bed".

[KenBoorman]

I'm sorry - I can't follow your reasoning, or your logic. We just agree to disagree, ok?

Ken

[Bill]

"Which is different from some twat recording a gig and selling it for their onw benefit without royalties to DB & co."

Trading a live gig for another live gig - unless that show is being released officially - takes no money from Dave's wallet. Whatsoever.

[zakt]

:?: :?: An artist should have some control of their work, don't you think? There is by definition only a limited market for all works, and only a limited number of works by each artist that those of us too limited in talent and perspicacity to produce, want to purchase. If Dave Brock wants to control the production and distribution of his work, I would suggest he has a right to do so. There are copyright laws which control disrtibution by normal means, but the technology now available makes it very difficult to enforce these. If he reasonably asks his "fans" not to make and distribute non-copyright recordings, is that an example of monster capitalism, or is it an artist attempting to control the quality and quantity of their output? I'd suggest the latter.

Look back at the situation Dickens had in the 19th Century when US publishers were copying his work on a massive scale, losing him considerable quantities of income. Hawkwind are not in the enviable position of having massive domestic income to fall back on. There is plenty of "legit" product to buy, and if you exhaust that stream maybe it's time to start listening to another band occasionally?